Comments on: The Trouble with VOC-compliant Finishes

By: Randy B

Randy B — Thu, 09 Feb 2012 01:47:26 +0000

I’m not sure if is due to VOC compliance but has anyone tried to buy oil based varnish lately? I like to mix my own oil-varnish mix so I can increase the amout of varnish and decrease the oil in the later coats to get a quicker build and faster drying. I just ran out of varnish and went to buy some more but all my usual sources no longer carry it. I’ve read that Arm-R-Seal and Waterlox are il-varnish mixes and get good reviews. My local wood store (Woodworkers Source) carries Old Master’s tung oil varnish, has anyone used that? Sorry if I’ve sidetracked this post but it it frustrating when something you’ve used for years is suddenly gone.

By: Steve_OH

Steve_OH — Wed, 08 Feb 2012 17:42:07 +0000

You have to read MSDS info in context. Here’s an extract of the MSDS of a commonly available chemical:

——–

Potential Health Effects

Eye: Causes severe eye irritation. May cause painful sensitization to light. May cause chemical conjunctivitis and corneal damage.

Skin: Causes moderate skin irritation. May cause cyanosis of the extremities.

Ingestion: May cause gastrointestinal irritation with nausea, vomiting and diarrhea. May cause systemic toxicity with acidosis. May cause central nervous system depression, characterized by excitement, followed by headache, dizziness, drowsiness, and nausea. Advanced stages may cause collapse, unconsciousness, coma and possible death due to respiratory failure.

Inhalation: Inhalation of high concentrations may cause central nervous system effects characterized by nausea, headache, dizziness, unconsciousness and coma. Causes respiratory tract irritation. May cause narcotic effects in high concentration. Vapors may cause dizziness or suffocation.

Chronic: May cause reproductive and fetal effects. Laboratory experiments have resulted in mutagenic effects. Animal studies have reported the development of tumors. Prolonged exposure may cause liver, kidney, and heart damage.

First Aid Measures

Eyes: Immediately flush eyes with plenty of water for at least 15 minutes, occasionally lifting the upper and lower eyelids. Get medical aid. Gently lift eyelids and flush continuously with water.

Skin: Get medical aid. Flush skin with plenty of water for at least 15 minutes while removing contaminated clothing and shoes. Wash clothing before reuse. Flush skin with plenty of soap and water.

Ingestion: Do NOT induce vomiting. If victim is conscious and alert, give 2-4 cupfuls of milk or water. Never give anything by mouth to an unconscious person. Get medical aid.

Inhalation: Remove from exposure and move to fresh air immediately. If not breathing, give artificial respiration. If breathing is difficult, give oxygen. Get medical aid. Do NOT use mouth-to-mouth resuscitation.

——–

What is the horrifyingly nasty chemical in this example? 70% ethanol in water. In other words, vodka.

The point is that just about anything you can breathe or drink can have pretty nasty effects. The MSDS is required to present the worst-case scenario. That doesn’t mean that you should ignore the MSDS, but you do have to understand what it’s really trying to say. There are big differences between casual exposure, occupational exposure, and accidental high exposure.

-Steve

By: Matthew Teague

Matthew Teague — Wed, 08 Feb 2012 15:18:59 +0000

Thanks for the note, Robert. I keep hearing different opinions from experts in the field as to the concentrations of PCBTF and other solvents necessary to create a safety hazard. And we are looking into it further here at the magazine. But, yes, better safe than sorry: As you point out, wearing a respirator is never a bad idea.
–Matthew

By: Matthew Teague

Matthew Teague — Tue, 07 Feb 2012 21:10:51 +0000

It smells more of lemon than orange, but I know the stuff you’re talking about too. Neither have to stand on the surface and dry like a traditional paste wax, which means I can give everything a quick rub-down before it goes to its new home. . . it makes the surface feel almost buttery underhand and gives furniture the equivalent of that new-car smell.

By: Matthew Teague

Matthew Teague — Tue, 07 Feb 2012 21:07:13 +0000

Thanks. You got this one answered before I could get to it. And did a better job of explaining the process than I did above.

By: Matthew Teague

Matthew Teague — Tue, 07 Feb 2012 21:02:46 +0000

A fine point. Aside from the smell–something that could be overcome in a number of different ways–I’m sure the finish I used and many other VOC compliant finishes are just fine. My only problem was that the working qualities were so different from what I was accustomed to using that I made some mistakes that didn’t go away until I sanded back nearly to wood. Things could have been a lot worse.
Thanks.

By: kct3937

kct3937 — Tue, 07 Feb 2012 20:45:09 +0000

Is this stuff a beeswax/oil blend that smells of orange? It looks like another product that I got years ago called Beeswax Wood Preserver by Lustre Products in Colorado.
If it is, I agree that it is really good.

By: MikeHenderson

MikeHenderson — Tue, 07 Feb 2012 18:33:43 +0000

Here in California we were forced to the VOC compliant finishes some time ago. There was a lot of grumbling during the transition, but guess what – the VOC stuff is really good now. I mostly spray lacquer and the water based stuff works well as long as you understand the differences between it and the older solvent based stuff. The water based is very clear – so much so that it appears white – so I shoot dewaxed shellac first to give an orange base. This makes the finish look the same as the older solvent based finish.
Final comment – the new finishes are quite good, you just have to learn the differences and how to work with it. If we had all started with low VOC finishes, we’d have difficulties with solvent based finishes.

By: Danny H.

Danny H. — Tue, 07 Feb 2012 16:39:28 +0000

Mat, Be glad you don’t live in Calif. At least when it comes to purchasing and using finishing products. As you may already know this state is VOC compliant and it’s causing a great deal of problems and it seems to be getting worse every year. I went into my local pro paint shop just a few weeks ago to purchase a can of regular mineral spirits and was told that they no longer carried it and that the new voc compliant stuff wasn’t much good for mixing with paint. They suggested that I go to a big box store and purchase what old stuff they had left since once that was gone there would be no more available in this state. I went in just and few days ago for something else and was told that the new voc compliant mineral spirits formula had already changed since the last time I was in. Lacquer thinner has also gone VOC compliant( It’s now more like Acetone) as well and it now cost in excess of twenty dollars a gallon. I have children living in Arizona so the next trip over I think I’m going to stock up on the old formula’s.

By: tombuhl

tombuhl — Tue, 07 Feb 2012 16:32:04 +0000

This is my standard method of finishing for much the same reasons as Matthew states. After the initial coat dries, I wipe on generous amount (wouldn’t call it flooding) and wet sand with progressively (in subsequent coats) higher grits. I work on sections at a time, so that I am wet sanding before finish gets tacky. Then I wipe with rag until “dry,” then give it a quick “polish” wipe with another clean rag. Despite wiping until feeling dry it is building some finish (a miracle). After that coat sets overnight (or half a day), you may have a few minor nibs and such, but the next wet sanded wet coat takes care of it, without a separate pre-finishing sanding.

If the finish gets to a tacky state before you begin the wet sanding this doesn’t work so well. But simple fix is to just apply more fresh finish over that surface, then proceed to wet sand and life is good.

I use a mix of varnish/poly, mineral spirits and tung or BLO, in 3:2:1. I used to use 3:3:3 but found each coat took too long to cure with that much oil. Also tried without any oil, but I missed the lubricating properties of the oil. Ratios are not that significant, lots of room to play.

Sometimes I’ve waxed after all is cured, but generally just do a buffing with cloth. Think I may give Matthew’s Oil & Wax product a try. Sounds like nice way to wrap up the project.